AILSA CHANG, HOST:
At the Pentagon today, Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth gave a robust defense of the U.S. airstrikes on Iran's nuclear program. He staunchly backed President Trump's assertion that the program has been destroyed. He also ripped into the media saying it's more focused on, quote, "cheering (ph) against" the president than covering the historic nature of the event. NPR Pentagon correspondent Tom Bowman was at that briefing, and we're also joined by NPR's Greg Myre. Hello to both of you.
TOM BOWMAN, BYLINE: Hey, Ailsa.
GREG MYRE, BYLINE: Hey, Ailsa.
CHANG: OK, Tom, let's start with you. Did we get any clarity at that briefing on the key question, which is still, how much damage has been done to Iran's nuclear program?
BOWMAN: No, we still don't have a clear and final assessment on the damage at the three Iranian nuclear facilities. On Sunday, Joint Chiefs Chairman Gen. Dan Caine told reporters that, quote, "final battle damage will take some time, and it would be way too early for me to comment on what may or may not still be there." So I wondered, you know, is there some new information that made the administration more confident about the damage? I asked the general, and then the secretary jumped in.
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BOWMAN: What changed in the past three days and make you so, you know...
PETE HEGSETH: Sir, I think...
BOWMAN: ...Certain?
HEGSETH: I mean, I think I explained what changed. There was a great deal of irresponsible reporting based on leaks - preliminary information in low confidence. Again, when someone leaks something, they do it with an agenda.
BOWMAN: You know, what he's talking about is a report NPR and other news organizations had on preliminary, low-confidence report from the Defense Intelligence Agency saying the attacks put back Iran's nuclear program by a few months. But we also reported - and others did - more information, of course, would be forthcoming. Also, just today, the top U.N. nuclear watchdog Rafael Grossi said it appears centrifuges for nuclear enrichment at one of the plants are no longer operational.
CHANG: OK. Well, there's been speculation that Iran still possesses enriched uranium and it may have moved that uranium before the U.S. strikes even happened. Did Hegseth at all address that question?
BOWMAN: Well, reporters asked about that, and Secretary Hegseth would only say that he was not aware of any intelligence that anything was out of place. But Rafael Grossi said the enriched uranium may have been moved, and Iranian officials told him they have taken special measures to protect the material. And just today, Israeli Defense Minister Israel Katz said Iran must hand over whatever they have.
CHANG: OK. Well, Greg, turning to you, I understand that we also heard the backstory on how long the U.S. military has been preparing to hit Fordo, the nuclear site. Can you tell us about that backstory?
MYRE: Yeah, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs, Gen. Dan Caine, said the U.S. detected Iran's work on the mountain in Fordo early on. So in 2009, the military selected a couple officers with the Pentagon's Defense Threat Reduction Agency to work on this full-time.
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DAN CAINE: For more than 15 years, this officer and his teammate lived and breathed this single target, Fordo. He watched the Iranians dig it out. He watched the construction, the weather, the discard material, the geology, every nook, every crater, every piece of equipment going in and every piece of equipment going out. They literally dreamed about this target at night when they slept.
MYRE: So while they're doing all this work, they couldn't discuss it with family or friends. They just kept grinding away in secret through all the twists and turns of Iran's nuclear program over the years.
CHANG: All right. OK, so as they were studying the program, what sort of recommendations were they making?
MYRE: Yeah, the officers knew this was a critically important site for Iran, that it wasn't building this advanced, complex underground facility for peaceful civilian nuclear energy. And they came to realize the U.S. didn't have a weapon that could reach a target that deep inside a mountain, perhaps 300 feet down. Caine said they began working with munitions experts to build this huge 30,000-pound bunker-busting bomb, known as the Massive Ordnance Penetrator.
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CAINE: They tested it over and over again. They accomplished hundreds of test shots and dropped many full-scale weapons against extremely realistic targets for a single purpose - kill this target at the time and place of our nation's choosing.
CHANG: OK. Well, Greg, while questions still remain about how effective these attacks really were, what do we know about the officers who helped plan the Fordo attack?
MYRE: Yeah, Gen. Caine put it this way.
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CAINE: More than 15 years after they started their life's work, the phone rang, and the president of the United States ordered the B-2 force that you've supported to go strike and kill this target.
MYRE: So Caine declined to name the officers. He just said they were still in their positions at the Defense Threat Reduction Agency. He said he met with them yesterday and cited one of them as saying, quote, "I can't even get my head around this." I'll just add briefly that Defense Secretary Hegseth, in his criticism of the media, said the press didn't want to talk about all the military members involved in this operation. I can assure you we'd love to talk to these officers and the others involved.
CHANG: Oh, yeah. OK, Tom, last question to you. As we just heard from Greg, you know, we're getting all these details today about the attack, but not the extent of the damage. What do you think the administration is trying to do here?
BOWMAN: Well, clearly, they're focusing on what is, without doubt, an oppressive military operation, but sidestepping questions about the damage assessment and any remaining enriched uranium. Maybe they have answers, maybe they don't, but senators and House members will still be asking these same questions in closed-door hearings today and tomorrow.
CHANG: That is NPR's Tom Bowman and Greg Myre. Thank you to both of you.
BOWMAN: You're welcome.
MYRE: Sure thing, Ailsa. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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